Posts by Bluegrass Tom

16

The WTS society admits that the door to door ministry is inefficient

by cultswatter in

look at what the scans below say.

that publishers spend considerable gas and insurance and time to go from door to door to place the odd magazine or book.

in reality the jw publisher is footing the whole bill and then some.. the jw publisher has to spend about 100 dollars per month for every dollar from donations received for literature sold at the door.. i know this to be true as i used to flog books at the door.

Bluegrass Tom

In my mind the bottom line is this: Jesus command is to make disciples-period. It is not to go door to door. When you read the bible accounts of the first century you find that the apostles and disciples spent long periods of time doing other things than the public ministry. They traveled, worked, spoke with other people, but were not constantly preaching. They apparently had lives, although worship was the cnterpiece of thoes lives after conversion. Today the WTBTS wants a person not to have a life but to attend five meetings a week, conduct personal or family study in the off hours, and be in service on Saturday and Sunday. It is a control policy as far as I am concened, and not an immitation of the first century christian congregation.

54

Why Is Everything Always Wrong To A Jehovah's Witness???

by minimus in

jw
friends

nothing is ok. everything is problematic..... what if you stumble someone???--------.

let's say you want to invite someone over, you gotta worry about someone thinking your favoring this one over another.

you might be accused of having "cliques".

Bluegrass Tom

The problem is that almost all the members of the congregatin are judgemental. They are told not to be by the "Slave" but are anyway. It is human nature and the culture of the organization fosters it. The Society condones and encourages everyone watching one another and reporting people if and observation reveals something questionable. This is one thing that drives people away. This constant policing from the membership and the enforcement of manmade rules.

5

Need Help on "Generation" Research

by Bluegrass Tom in

i made the mistake of having a discussion about the "generation" understanding.

i stated that the 1994 wa was the latest change in that doctrine, abandoning the concept of 1914+70/80 year span of a generation=1994 max.

i was told by a practicing dub (a real kool-aid drinker) that there is a "new light" on this matter after the 1994 wa.

Bluegrass Tom

I made the mistake of having a discussion about the "Generation" understanding. I stated that the 1994 WA was the latest change in that doctrine, abandoning the concept of 1914+70/80 year span of a generation=1994 Max. I was told by a practicing dub (a real Kool-Aid drinker) that there is a "new light" on this matter after the 1994 WA. This modified understanding is that we are living in "the time of the end" and the "generation" now means all the people on earth that are alive at this "time of the end". Has anybody else heard of this understanding? Does anybody know what WA articles say this? I am getting ready to continue this discussion, mistake or not.

17

Did the Watchtower Society Cause Mental or Emotional Damage?

by The wanderer in

jw
friends

did the watchtower society cause mental or emotional damage?the argument is the watchtower caused one, the other, or a combination .

in my particular case, it was emotional damage because individuals consider me .

to be fairly intelligent and clear minded.. what is your perspective about this matter?did the watchtower cause mental or emotional damage?

Bluegrass Tom

It certainly did cause damage to many people. Being and adherent to the religion places a person under a level of stress that is man induced and way beyond the performance criteria that God outlines for worship in the Bible. To describe this stress would be a thread in itself. If you dutifully follow the teachings of the WB&TS you will become isolated from the world in general, perhaps even blood relatives, and will not be able to have any meaningful relationships with other co-inhabiters of the planet. You will be deprived of taking advantage of getting a higher education that would enhanse your life in numerous ways and allow you to earn a living that would provide a basis for an adequate life-style. If you lived through the 1975 episode like many of us did, that is entirely another discussion. Just ask the people that come from that period of time who listened and followed what they were told. They pioneered or did some equivalent service, became professional office cleaners for support and now are looking at the back end of their life living in an apartment, with no pension, real estate or other means to sustain reitrement. The "Generation" understanding that they all banked on went up in smoke. Where really are we in the stream of time? What will we be told next? "Keep on hanging in there.....the end is close. We really mean it this time!"

13

Has anyone seen this research on 607 and the Watchtower?

by lurker in

jw
friends

i was recently searching the web for information on 607 to discuss with my wife and i came up with this.

http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/607/default.html these people say that they are proving the watchtowers 607 date correct.

i am convinced that the watchtower is wrong because of all the other things that i have researched but i would welcome any feedback.

Bluegrass Tom

Check this out.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/82648/1350945/post.ashx#1350945

22

How did you tell old distant friends that you faded? Or do you?

by cab1000 in

jw
friends

you all have been so helpful in the past with these things...and i have another "how to deal" question.... ok, we have been faded for a while now.

we have pumkins out for halloween, as well as fun decorations...the problem is..we got an anniversary card today in the mail from some old witness friends where we used to live...they wish they could visit...they are prone to drop by un announced...so..have any of you had any sucess of "warning" old witness friends that you have changed?.

we are still trying not to get disfellowshiped for family reasons.

Bluegrass Tom

It is true that if they visit there will probably be some fallout over your personal choices in life. One thing that you might consider doing is that since they sent you a card, you can send them back a note thanking them for the card and telling them that for personal reasons you do not want any visitors.

This is our approach. We tell the Friends not to stop by unless invited. It works pretty well. They don't have to bother, and legally they are exposed if they stop by because you were specific with them before hand. None of the Brothers want to be exposed legally.

9

Douglas Walsh Case

by Bluegrass Tom in

.

i am trying to obtain a copy of the douglas walsh case -scotland 1954, or other court transcripts where gb members took the stand and testimony was given pertaining to being the "channel", "1914", the ability to translate ancient languages or other salient topics.

i think there was a trial in nyc about the same period where some of these topics were covered.. if any one can direct me where i can obtain copies of these i would appreciat it.

Bluegrass Tom

Thanks everyone for the leads.

9

Douglas Walsh Case

by Bluegrass Tom in

.

i am trying to obtain a copy of the douglas walsh case -scotland 1954, or other court transcripts where gb members took the stand and testimony was given pertaining to being the "channel", "1914", the ability to translate ancient languages or other salient topics.

i think there was a trial in nyc about the same period where some of these topics were covered.. if any one can direct me where i can obtain copies of these i would appreciat it.

Bluegrass Tom

I am trying to obtain a copy of the Douglas Walsh Case -Scotland 1954, or other court transcripts where GB Members took the stand and testimony was given pertaining to being the "Channel", "1914", the ability to translate ancient languages or other salient topics. I think there was a trial in NYC about the same period where some of these topics were covered.

If any one can direct me where I can obtain copies of these I would appreciat it.

5

Proposal for Annulment of Dedication and Baptism

by Bluegrass Tom in

i was baptized in the mid-1960's.

this is 40 years ago.

things have changed doctrinally since then.

Bluegrass Tom

I was baptized in the mid-1960's. This is 40 years ago. Things have changed doctrinally since then. I am contemplating creating a document that lists all the differences in WTB&TS doctrine from the 1960's and today. Such things as the questions asked at baptism are different today (this is what a person verbally agreed to), 1975, the generation, blood, organ transplants, education, voting, membership in the UN as an NGO, the light getting brighter, etc. The basis of my position is that the doctrine of the religion is substantially different than what I was initialy taught and agreed to. Therefore there are changed conditions by the WTB&TS, not by me. This should allow the relationship to be terminated (annulled) without disassociation. As a matter of fairness the WTB&TS should institute a process that allows annulment under certain circumstances because they keep changin their positions on many areas of doctrine. This impacts peoples lives and feelings.

I intend to develop this document, and take it to a lawyer that specializes in this type of religious litigation. There are several I have found. My goal is to try and institute a process and policy of a negotiated annulment for any who can justify annulment in lieu of disassociation. If this has to be litigated, so be it. Disassociation is too self-serving to the WTB&TS, and only socially damages the one who disassociates themselves. The practice of disassociation is unfair in this instance, since they changed, not me.This could possibly apply to others who are in this situation (being associated for a substantial period of time) and didn't sign-on for the doctrinal point of view that exists today on the part of the WTB&TS.

If anyone can assist with references from the publications, give ideas in the changes in doctrine from the 1960's to today, or input on this general philosophy of mine, I appreciate your help. I don't want to exclude any changes that were made. I want to have a comprehensive listing with examples and references.

I know that this will be a difficult undertaking, but I feel that I may have to try.

8

Need Help on 1967 Baptism Questions

by Bluegrass Tom in

i have some good researching capablity, but i am caught-up short on this one.

i need any help that i can get.. i was baptized in 1967. i am trying to find out the questions that were asked at baptism.

this is before the"lamp" book was released.

Bluegrass Tom

Blondie:

Thanks. You are great!. Yes I did mean the questions that were asked at the Assembly when baptized.

Thanks again.